From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 01:43:07 -0400 From: FRDHVY@aol.com Subject: re: Jerry S on light and DNA I have to comment on part of Jerry's response to Keith. While I agree fully that light can not transmit life, I believe light, especially coherent light can transmit all the information that is necessary to manifest life. While I agree that DNA is not necessary to make life (after all, RNA works, too), I believe that DNA and RNA, and perhaps some other complex, self replicating molecules are ideally suited as mediators in the creation of life. These chemicals have several features that make them useful, mechanical stability, chemical stability, wildly flexible tertiery structure, self reproducing capacity, etc. I suspect that Jerry is correct when he states that the mathematical diverse potential of DNA is so great that all the possible combinations have not been tried in nature, but I do not see that as a very strong argument, as it appears that the combinations that work are in use. He quotes Mainzer as the source of this idea, so this criticism is obviously directed at Mainzer. As to the amount of information needed to create a human brain, I could stretch my imagination to accept the conclusion, had I not seen a number of human brains, both functional, and non-functional, in my lifetime. Given the state of knowledge of DNA and RNA, and without an alternative hypothesis to test, I tend to accept the idea that DNA is capable of creating the machine we know as the brain. Now, having said that, I also believe there is something more, spirit, which is necessary to add to the machine, before we have a total human. The functioning human is obviously something greater than the sum of its parts. HPB has already made that clear. Our physical body and its components comprise only a part of the totality. Returning to light for a moment, it is interesting to note that DNA is responsive to light, with the capability to respond diferently to differnt light frequencies. In its most dramatic manifestation, UV light is well documented to cause skin cancers. This is postulated to occur when the UV light causes breaks in chromosomes which lead to uncontrolled cellular division. There are some studies that seem to indicate that exposure to specific frequencies of light at critical times in development may trigger expression of some genes. Examination of the topic on the physical plane alone belies the complexity of the subject, however. We must remember that there is much more to life than the physical plane. Any comments? Love and light. Fred From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 01:45:17 -0400 From: FRDHVY@aol.com Subject: re: American Theosophist Hi everyone! The greatest praise we may give the AT is to submit our efforts so John has enough material to pick and choose. The publication is very high quality, and getting better each issue. Each of us has an article or two within us. I'm sure some of the participants on this discussion group have not published before. It really doesn't hurt! You learn a lot about yourself in the writing process. And John is a great editor, easy to work with, and full of constructive suggestions. A lot of ideas we see on this list are worthy of expansion into AT articles. We have our work cut out for us. Make the effort to reap the rewards. Share your thoughts and grow. Love and light, Fred From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 02:07:09 -0400 From: jrcecon@lewis.umt.edu Subject: Re: re: American Theosophist Fred wrote: > The greatest praise we may give the AT is to submit our efforts so John has enough material to pick and choose. The publication is very high quality, and getting better each issue. Each of us has an article or two within us. I'm sure some of the participants on this discussion group have not published before. It really doesn't hurt! You learn a lot about yourself in the writing process. And John is a great editor, easy to work with, and full of constructive suggestions. A lot of ideas we see on this list are worthy of expansion into AT articles. We have our work cut out for us. Make the effort to reap the rewards. Share your thoughts and grow. Say ... wonder whether the AT might consider something like a half-page or page long regular column called "NETworking" (or a rather less goofy title) compsed of juicy excerpts from conversations on this list ... we really *do* have discussions here as lively as any article I've read in the AT, and the dialogue format might make (with a bit of editing) for some very readable text. Would also serve to (perhaps) get other Theosophists interested in coming on-line into the discussions. Just musing on a smashing summer day ... -JRC From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 12:34:14 -0400 From: "Lewis Lucas" Subject: Re: re: American Theosophist Fred wrote: > The greatest praise we may give the AT is to submit our efforts so John has enough material to pick and choose. The publication is very high quality, and getting better each issue. Each of us has an article or two within us. I'm sure some of the participants on this discussion group have not published before. It really doesn't hurt! You learn a lot about yourself in the writing process. And John is a great editor, easy to work with, and full of constructive suggestions. A lot of ideas we see on this list are worthy of expansion into AT articles. We have our work cut out for us. Make the effort to reap the rewards. Share your thoughts and grow. Say ... wonder whether the AT might consider something like a half-page or page long regular column called "NETworking" (or a rather less goofy title) compsed of juicy excerpts from conversations on this list ... we really *do* have discussions here as lively as any article I've read in the AT, and the dialogue format might make (with a bit of editing) for some very readable text. Would also serve to (perhaps) get other Theosophists interested in coming on-line into the discussions. Just musing on a smashing summer day ... -JRC I think this is an excellent idea and hope Rubin passes it along to John. Lewis llucas@mercury.gc.peachnet.edu From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 12:36:46 -0400 From: APRIORIPAA@aol.com Subject: 1900 K.H. Letter? I found this letter/text posted in the public domain on compuserve and thought to share it here. Does anyone know what book/publication it might be from? Peace, Patrick THE 1900 LETTER A psychic and a pranayamist who has got confused by the vagaries of the members. The T.S. and its members are slowly manufacturing a creed. Says a Thibetan proverb "credulity breeds credulity and ends in hypocrisy." How few are they who can know anything about us. Are we to be propitiated and made idols of. Is the worship of a new Trinity made up of the Blessed M., Upasika and yourself to take the place of exploded creeds. We ask not for the worship of ourselves. The disciple should in no way be fettered. Beware of an Esoteric Popery. The intense desire to see Upasika reincarnate at once has raised a misleading Mayavic ideation. Upasika has useful work to do on higher planes and cannot come again so soon. The T.S. must safely be ushered into the new century. You have for some time been under deluding influences. Shun pride, vanity and love of power. Be not guided by emotion but learn to stand alone. Be accurate and critical rather than credulous. The mistake of the past in the old religions must not be glossed over with imaginary explanations. The E.S.T. must be reformed so as to be as unsectarian and creedless as the T.S.. The rules must be few and simple and acceptable to all. No one has the right to claim authority over a pupil or his conscience. Ask him not what he believes. All who are sincere and pure minded must have admittance. The crest wave of intellectual advancement must be taken hold of and guided into spirituality. It cannot be forced into beliefs and emotional worship. The essence of the higher thoughts of the members in their collectivity must guide all action in the T.S. and E.S.. We never try to subject to ourselves the will of another. At favourable times we let loose elevating influences which strike various persons in various ways. It is the collective aspect of many such thoughts that can give the correct note of action. We show no favours. The best corrective of error is an honest and open-minded examination of all facts subjective and objective. Misleading secrecy has given the death blow to numerous organizations. The cant about "Masters" must be silently but firmly put down. Let the devotion and service be to that Supreme Spirit alone of which one is a part. Namelessly and silently we work and the continual references to ourselves and the repetition of our names raises up a confused aura that hinders our work. You will have to leave a good deal of your emotions and credulity before you become a safe guide among the influences that will commence to work in the new cycle. The T.S. was meant to be the corner-stone of the future religions of humanity. To accomplish this object those who lead must leave aside their weak predilections for the forms and ceremonies of any particular creed and show themselves to be true Theosophists both in inner thoughts and outward observances. The greatest of your trials is yet to come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your strength. K.H. (Underlined print indicates omitted sections). From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 21:48:23 -0400 From: "Ann E. Bermingham" <72723.2375@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: UFO connections/time travel Keith writes: > I am thinking about Lucid Dreaming! . . . It happens to me usually when I am deprived of sleep. Strange. I've done my best lucid dreaming when I've had too much sleep. (Something I'm definitely not doing since I'm attending Summer School at Olcott.) My husband also claims that lots of sleep is good for astral projections. > Crick who helped map DNA believes that life was spored from another place in the galaxy. That the age of the earth and the complexity of life are not compatible with evolution as it is currently taught (without involution). (Gasp!) You mean we're all an experiment? We're all in a ZOO or just a bunch of lab rats running in a maze? :-))) When do I get my piece of cheese? Seriously, this was fascinating bit of news to ponder. - ann From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 22:29:28 -0400 From: "Janice Hensley (SAIL)" Subject: Re: I just subscribed to this listserv the other day. Right now I am here in Tampa awaiting the arrival of Huricaine Erin and reading these postings over a glass of wine. Fundamentalism, hmmmmm..., I used to be a fundamentalist in a 'previous incarnation'. There are fundamentalists in all of the revealed religions. I would think you would see a rise of fundamentalism during more unsure times. There is a sense of security obtained when you have all the answers outlined for you. I know that there was for me. It was tough leaving a fundamentalist Christian mindset several years ago - especially coming from an unstable home situation as an early foundation. But... the pull for truth was stronger than the need for easy answers. The implications of a rise in fundamentalism? Scarey. I think fundamentalists, being less flexible in their respective positions, are more apt to fight to the death for what they perceive as truth for them. In one sense having this courage of conviction is admirable, but on a deeper level and when it is thought through this is very dangerous since every different fundamentalist group believes their truth is absolute. I believe that their perspectives COULD be understood as absolute IF they were viewed more symbolically/metaphorically rather than literally, but of course this is not usually the case. Oh well. As a result of my own spiritual journey/study, I can integrate all major religions to fit within my personel worldview. Instead of an exclusive fundamentalist belief system, I now have one that is inclusive and open minded...and still can find great comfort in this! In fact, I now feel more connected to and in love with my world/universe than ever. Namaste, Jan Janice Hensley jhensley@chuma.cas.usf.edu > Your question is similar to one I have been pondering. What are the reasons and implications of the rise in fundamentalism around the world? I would be interested in others comments. > Lewis llucas@mercury.gc.peachnet.edu From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 23:10:22 -0400 From: Jerry Schueler <76400.1474@compuserve.com> Subject: Re to Fred Fred: < I suspect that Jerry is correct when he states that the mathematical diverse potential of DNA is so great that all the possible combinations have not been tried in nature, but I do not see that as a very strong argument, as it appears that the combinations that work are in use... Now, having said that, I also believe there is something more, spirit, which is necessary to add to the machine, before we have a total human. > But WHY is it that the "combinations that work are in use?" The "argument" that I was trying to make is that there has not been enough time in our evolution for nature to "try out" all of the possibilities inherent in our DNA before reaching the current combinations. Keith, I believe, alluded to this lack of time and I was following up on the theme. Either there is a "God" controlling things, or a very significant "coincidence" occurred somewhere in the past. Darwinism can't explain it. But the possibility of symbiosis, or mutual cooperation, seems viable to me (especially _conscious_ symbiosis). Fred: Yes, she did. But my point is that science is now (finally!) also picking up on it, especailly within the new chaos and complexity theories. Comment: Fred's mention of the need for spirit is vital here. DNA, without the guidance/governance of the astral, mental, and spiritual prototypes behind it will never become "alive" in any true sense. Modern science has looked deeply into the human brain, and virtually all of the scientists who did so have been absolutely shocked by the vast complexity that they found there. Some of the basic neuro-networking stuff has even been modeled in mathematics already, but many scientists are now arguing that only parts (subsystems) can be modeled with any realism owing to the compexity. For example, we now know that oour brains do NOT work like a computer. Brains cells do not hold data like computer RAM (or ROM). It looks more like electronic imaging of a very complex sort is going on. But so far, consciousness itself has eluded the scentists. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 23:17:36 -0400 From: "John Vorstermans" Subject: Re: 1900 K.H. Letter? Hi Patrick. > I found this letter/text posted in the public domain on compuserve and thought to share it here. Does anyone know what book/publication it might be from? I am not sure exactly where it was first made public but I read it first about 6 years ago in two seperate papers. One was I think a newlsetter published by the Point Loma TS and the other was published in the Theosophical History Journel which I believe was made available via the British (Adjar) TS but has been discontinued. The article itself is interesting and has inspired much debate and reflection. Regards John -- John Vorstermans | Obstacles are what you see john@actrix.gen.nz | when you take your eyes off Help desk - (04) 499-1122 | the goal From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 23:29:24 -0400 From: Johlt@aol.com Subject: Hello! I'm a new subscriber to this list; I have to admit that I'm not really all that knowledgeable in the area of theosophy, but it sounded very interesting and I felt called to join in on the conversation. Can someone recommend some works that would help me get up to speed on the subject? I'd really appreciate it! Thanks in advance, John Holton From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 00:48:26 -0400 From: brenda@theosophy.com (Brenda S. Tucker) Subject: Hello back! > I'm a new subscriber to this list; I have to admit that I'm not really all that knowledgeable in the area of theosophy, but it sounded very interesting and I felt called to join in on the conversation. Can someone recommend some works that would help me get up to speed on the subject? I'd really appreciate it! > Thanks in advance, John Holton Information regarding books is available from the Olcott Library. OLCOTT@DUPAGELS.LIB.IL.US Olcott Library There are other theosophical libraries (one below) and Quest Books is a theosophical book store which you may find in your area. DEODARS@AOL.COM Theosophical Library Pasadena THEOS@NETCOM.COM Theosophical Society In Am. There may be other e-mail addresses like the three above who are subscribers to theos-l which I have neglected to post. From time to time there have also been lists of suggested reading here. The following is an example: > I recommend the following 6 or so books: > (1) An Introduction to Esoteric Principles by William Doss McDavid Paper, $7.50 This is an excellent introduction to HPB's teachings. > Order from The Theosophical Publishing House, P.O. Box 270, Wheaton, Illinois 60189. > (2) Deity, Cosmos and Man: An Outline of Esoteric Science by Geoffrey A. Farthing. Paper, $15.00. > Also a good introduction to Theosophy as presented by HPB and the Masters. > Order from Point Loma Publications, P.O. Box 6507, San Diego, California 92166 > (3) The Key to Theosophy with a Glossary by H.P. Blavatsky. Paper, $10.00 An introduction to Theosophy in HPB's own words. > The best edition in print is available from The Theosophical University Press, P.O. Box C, Pasadena, California 91109. > (4) The Voice of the Silence translated by H.P. Blavatsky. Paper, $5.00. > Available from Theosophical University Press, see address above. > Another good edition of The Voice of the Silence is the centenary edition with a historical introduction published by The Theosophical Publishing House, see address above. Paper, $5.95. > (5) Abridgement of The Secret Doctrine by H.P. Blavatsky. Edited by Elizabeth Preston and Christmas Humphreys. Paper, $8.95. A good introduction to H.P.B.'s best known work. The essence of the S.D. in 250 pp. > Available from The Theosophical Publishing House, see address above. > (6) The Divine Plan by Geoffrey A. Barborka. Hardcover, $24.95. > Although not an introductory book, still this book is very helpful to anyone who wants to understand the basic ideas and concepts of the Secret Doctrine. This book by Barborka is a commentary on the S.D. and also defines key Sanskrit words used in the S.D. The index to the Divine Plan can be used like a glossary to explain key Theosophical and Sanskrit terms used by H.P.B. > Available from The Theosophical Publishing House, see address above. > I also recommend two biographical works on H.P. Blavatsky to help round out one's understanding: > (7) H.P.B.: The Extraordinary Life and Influence of Helena Blavatsky by Sylvia Cranston. Paper, 18.95; Hardcover; $30.00. > Available from The Theosophical University Press, see address above. > (8) The Occult World of Madame Blavatsky compiled and edited by Daniel H. Caldwell. $13.95, paper. > Available from Impossible Dream Publications, P.O. Box 1844, Tucson, Arizona 85702. > If you order by mail, these publishers also charge postage. Also prices do change. Here are the phone numbers of the publishers in order to confirm prices and postage: > The Theosophical Publishing House 1-800-669-9425 > The Theosophical University Press 1-818-798-3378 > Point Loma Publications 1-619-222-9609 > Impossible Dream Publications postage for the one book is $2.00. > Of course, you can order all these books through your local bookstore (especially your local metaphysical/new age bookstore). > Also all titles listed above are available from one source: > Wizards Bookshelf P.O. Box 6600 San Diego, California 92166 > Call 1-619-258-0049 for price confirmation and postage. > These recommendations compiled by Daniel H. Caldwell. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:34:04 -0400 From: APRIORIPAA@aol.com Subject: Re: 1900 K.H. Letter? > The article itself is interesting and has inspired much debate and reflection. Yes, in reading over the article/letter it seemed to me that the Masters at the time were somewhat withdrawing their full support for all of the T.S.'s activities -- as when "deluding" influences were mentioned and the need to eliminate pride and vanty. I suppose this didn't make someone very happy then. I very much like that the letter mentions that the Masters do not bend the will of another to their own -- as there has been so much of deception and the authoritative control drama that has been foisted on young ones. The spiritual path is walked in freedom. Peace, Patrick From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 12:24:53 -0400 From: naftaly@mdd.comm.mot.com (Naftaly Ramramkar) Subject: Re: Hello! > From: Johlt@aol.com > I'm a new subscriber to this list; I have to admit that I'm not really all that knowledgeable in the area of theosophy, but it sounded very interesting and I felt called to join in on the conversation. Can someone recommend some works that would help me get up to speed on the subject? I'd really appreciate it! > Thanks in advance, John Holton HI JOHN REGARDS FROM VANCOUVER, BC. LOTS OF REFERNCES AND BOOKS ARE AVAILABLE. HERE ARE FEW OF THOSE 1. BASIC THEOSOPHY : GEOFFREY HODSON 2. SELF CULTURE / WAY OF SELF DISCOVERY : I.K. TAIMANI 3. SEEKING WISDOM : N. SRI RAM 4. KEY TO THEOSOPHY: H.P. BLAVATSKY THERE ARE ALSO LOTS BASIC BOOKS FROM BEASANT/ LEADBEATER. THERE ALSO SOME FROM JUDGE. CALL THEOSOPHICAL BOOK SHOP :QUEST AT WHEATON IL. THEY WILL GUIDE YOU AND YOU CAN ORDER THESE BOOKS FROM THEM OR BORROW FROM THE LIBRARY BY MAIL (CONTACT: ELIZABETH TRUMPLER FOR BORROWING) SHANTI NAFTALY From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 12:40:00 -0400 From: "K. Paul Johnson" Subject: Re: Theosophical Network Dear Nick-- The KH letter to Besant was first published in the Eclectic Theosophist in its uncensored form. Subsequently, Theosophical History reprinted it. It is in my forthcoming Initiates of Theosophical Masters. I have posted it here, and could do so again if you like. Theosophical Network was published from 1986 through 1990, and I don't have any copies. But if all you need is the letter rather than any accompanying commentary, I'll provide. Paul From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 12:43:10 -0400 From: "judy a cilcain" Subject: Re: Hello! I'm a new subscriber to this list;... >> Thanks in advance, John Holton > HI JOHN > REGARDS FROM VANCOUVER, BC. > LOTS OF REFERNCES AND BOOKS ARE AVAILABLE. > HERE ARE FEW OF THOSE > 1. BASIC THEOSOPHY : GEOFFREY HODSON 2. SELF CULTURE / WAY OF SELF DISCOVERY : I.K. TAIMANI 3. SEEKING WISDOM : N. SRI RAM 4. KEY TO THEOSOPHY: H.P. BLAVATSKY THERE ARE ALSO LOTS BASIC BOOKS FROM BEASANT/ LEADBEATER. > THERE ALSO SOME FROM JUDGE. > CALL THEOSOPHICAL BOOK SHOP :QUEST AT WHEATON IL. THEY WILL GUIDE YOU AND YOU CAN ORDER THESE BOOKS FROM THEM OR BORROW FROM THE LIBRARY BY MAIL (CONTACT: ELIZABETH TRUMPLER FOR BORROWING) > SHANTI NAFTALY Naftaly and John: And of course the library is available via e-mail at: olcott@dupagels.lib.il.us Peace, Judy From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 09:08:24 -0400 From: "K. Paul Johnson" Subject: Re: 1900 K.H. Letter? The 1900 K.H. letter was published in a censored version many years ago. The full text first appeared in The Eclectic Theosophist in the late 1980s, and was reprinted in Theosophical History soon thereafter. The only book in which it appears, as far as I know, is my Initiates of Theosophical Masters, just out from SUNY Press. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 12:58:34 EDT From: "K. Paul Johnson" Subject: Anagram wisdom A while back I posted a list of anagrams of "information superhighway" and gave one for "Theosophical Society." Since then, I've done a few more and had folks supply others. There seems to be some kind of occult principle involved with anagrams, or else my imagination is running wild. The information superhighway ones included some that expressed the highest aspect of the internet, like "inspire humanity, who go far." Others were contemptuous of people's inflated view of it: "New utopia? Horrifying sham!" and "Waiting for any promise, huh?" Theosophical Society translates as "hey, cool sophisticate!" and "too hip scholastic eye" and "pithy ethos, cool as ice" but at the insulting end as "A psychic? Those, too, lie." United Lodge of Theosophists= Stodgiest of old punish thee This reminds me of a letter I once received. The Masters Revealed= A Severe Star Led Them, which might reflect its portrayal of political turmoil behind the scenes of a spiritual movement. K. Paul Johnson= junk shop loan, which someone else might find more enlightening than I have. Baha'i Faith= Haifa habit. (Many of these were sent to me and I haven't checked for accuracy-- no flames please). I would welcome any suggestions about what occult principles determine the fact that anagrams so often spell out hidden or subversive messages that can be astoundingly relevant to the overt message. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 13:00:56 -0400 From: "K. Paul Johnson" Subject: Anagram wisdom A while back I posted a list of anagrams of "information superhighway" and gave one for "Theosophical Society." Since then, I've done a few more and had folks supply others. There seems to be some kind of occult principle involved with anagrams, or else my imagination is running wild. The information superhighway ones included some that expressed the highest aspect of the internet, like "inspire humanity, who go far." Others were contemptuous of people's inflated view of it: "New utopia? Horrifying sham!" and "Waiting for any promise, huh?" Theosophical Society translates as "hey, cool sophisticate!" and "too hip scholastic eye" and "pithy ethos, cool as ice" but at the insulting end as "A psychic? Those, too, lie." United Lodge of Theosophists= Stodgiest of old punish thee This reminds me of a letter I once received. The Masters Revealed= A Severe Star Led Them, which might reflect its portrayal of political turmoil behind the scenes of a spiritual movement. K. Paul Johnson= junk shop loan, which someone else might find more enlightening than I have. Baha'i Faith= Haifa habit. (Many of these were sent to me and I haven't checked for accuracy-- no flames please). I would welcome any suggestions about what occult principles determine the fact that anagrams so often spell out hidden or subversive messages that can be astoundingly relevant to the overt message. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 13:40:11 -0700 From: brenda@theosophy.com (Brenda S. Tucker) Subject: We can't anagram - what? I tried anagrams with the program called "American Heritage Dictionary" using "Theosophical Society" and got Clothe icy apotheosis choose atheistic ploy are the ones my husband liked. Do they have to be exact? I've been trying to decide how to give the children some religious training. Geoffrey went to a Mommy and Me class at a synogogue and I really liked the people and the atmosphere there. My neighbor has been making such a fuss over me and she's catholic so I'm tempted to try Catholicism and like to tease her that's she must be trying to convert me. I found a church where Jewish and non-Jewish attend. It is called Messianic. They seemed very "joyful," sang songs of praises, and even danced in front of the altar. I read Galina a book recently on life in a Zen Buddhist monastery in Japan and she tried the meditation posture they teach as well as thought about other details of their lives comparing it with ours. I think I fit in better with the Jewish population than the Christian, and perhaps would like to put a list of holidays for anyone interested here. The Jewish holidays would be fun to learn and the list of Zen Buddhist holidays is the only other one that I have for now. In thinking about perhaps converting to one of these traditions, I try to prepare for it by reviewing what I have learned in the past. Reading the KABBALAH and what's in THE SECRET DOCTRINE regarding the KABBALAH certainly brings to mind a numerological and secret process involving words. By breaking words down and studying them, we provide them with an air of esotericism. Many people say the word holiday and plan their holidays without remembering simply that the word is derived from "holy day." Isn't it? Anyway this is what I think it signifies. Whenever you look behind the "dead letter" it is like opening doors and our imagination is allowed to spring into action causing seemingly dead earth and seed to bloom forth. Also the word Kabbalah doesn't lend itself to any anagrams. It's completely out in the open already. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 16:41:59 -0400 From: brenda@theosophy.com (Brenda S. Tucker) Subject: We can't anagram - what? I tried anagrams with the program called "American Heritage Dictionary" using "Theosophical Society" and got Clothe icy apotheosis choose atheistic ploy are the ones my husband liked. Do they have to be exact? I've been trying to decide how to give the children some religious training. Geoffrey went to a Mommy and Me class at a synogogue and I really liked the people and the atmosphere there. My neighbor has been making such a fuss over me and she's catholic so I'm tempted to try Catholicism and like to tease her that's she must be trying to convert me. I found a church where Jewish and non-Jewish attend. It is called Messianic. They seemed very "joyful," sang songs of praises, and even danced in front of the altar. I read Galina a book recently on life in a Zen Buddhist monastery in Japan and she tried the meditation posture they teach as well as thought about other details of their lives comparing it with ours. I think I fit in better with the Jewish population than the Christian, and perhaps would like to put a list of holidays for anyone interested here. The Jewish holidays would be fun to learn and the list of Zen Buddhist holidays is the only other one that I have for now. In thinking about perhaps converting to one of these traditions, I try to prepare for it by reviewing what I have learned in the past. Reading the KABBALAH and what's in THE SECRET DOCTRINE regarding the KABBALAH certainly brings to mind a numerological and secret process involving words. By breaking words down and studying them, we provide them with an air of esotericism. Many people say the word holiday and plan their holidays without remembering simply that the word is derived from "holy day." Isn't it? Anyway this is what I think it signifies. Whenever you look behind the "dead letter" it is like opening doors and our imagination is allowed to spring into action causing seemingly dead earth and seed to bloom forth. Also the word Kabbalah doesn't lend itself to any anagrams. It's completely out in the open already. From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 17:35:17 -0400 From: "Murray Stentiford, Scientific Software and Systems Ltd"@vnet.net Subject: Re Jerry S on Evolution > modern chaos theory has addressed evolution and given it some new and interesting views such as how complex systems self-organize, and that the whole is more than the sum of its parts. Also, a new view of evolution is growing in scientific circles that rejects Darwin's survival of the fittest and instead looks at symbiosis or mutual cooperation as the key ingredient for how living beings evolve (the key scientific players here are women, BTW). That's good to hear. I think that natural selection of mutations certainly happens, but is only one of several processes at work in evolution. One I haven't heard mentioned yet but reckon has a bit to do with it all is the fun factor. Watch kittens or lambs at play, and recall that good feelings enhance physical health. That would favour individuals and species that have more fun! > Mainzer .... describes a chaos model approach to the human brain and consciousness. He also points out that DNA cannot possibly carry all of the instructions needed to form a working brain nor could nature have had time to single out the complex choices that are being made given the awesome number of possibilities that exist ("The DNA molecule that comprises the total genome of a single bacterial cell represents one or a few choices out of more than 10 to one millionth power alternative sequences. Obviously, only a minute fraction of all such alternatives could have been tested by nature." I suspect that the vast improbability estimated would be a lot less if we looked at the evolutionary process as like some games where, at each stage, only certain moves are possible, developing a tree-like sequence of states with much smaller sets of choices than if it all depended on random choices from a wide-open set. There would be some kind of minimum-energy, highest-probability pathway that is taken all the way along the path of evolution, albeit in bursts of rapid change with long periods of slow change between them. Another factor could be the way life expresses itself at the cellular level, even to the point where you could say individual cells make choices. I'm thinking of the way certain cells in the human embryo take off and migrate long distances to take up their final positions and functions. Are they following some attractive scent or electrical field or even an etheric beacon, to a promised land, a wild west? The point being that adult structure and function are not always rigidly coded in some all-controlling information store like DNA. Likewise, neural pathways are clearly not all programmed in the DNA or anywhere else. Many are the result of growth under the impulse of desire to learn a new skill and the efforts to do it. How do they know where to go? We're looking at the emergence of archetypes of form, viewed from the underside. The panorama of the theosophical world view tells us a great deal, but there are major gaps yet to fill. Murray Stentiford From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 19:56:02 -0400 From: "John Vorstermans" Subject: Re: 1900 K.H. Letter? Hi Patrick > Yes, in reading over the article/letter it seemed to me that the Masters at the time were somewhat withdrawing their full support for all of the T.S.'s activities -- as when "deluding" influences were mentioned and the need to eliminate pride and vanty. I suppose this didn't make someone very happy then. KH and M who were two of the main instigators of planting the idea of the "Theosophical Seed" back in 1875 were not so much interested in how the "seeds" were planted but that they actually were planted. HPB and here helpers choose to form the TS to do this. However it must be remebered that HPB had a special link with the two Adepts mentioned and that it was stated in several articles that there they would no longer be able to communicated in writing (as they were) when HPB was no longer in physical incarnation. HPB herself was very much involved with the writtings it seems. (NOw, who HPB really was is a whole new excercise :-)). The 1900 letter, amongst other things raised doubts to whether the TS was actually successful in what it was initially proposed to be. HPB also had these doubts later in here life. She almost died several times while writing the Secret Doctrine but choose to remain in incarnation at least long enough to see this finished. This volume itself has probably done more good for "Theosophy" in it's last 100 years than has the TS has. She was so discouraged with the TS at the end that she made a last effort to try and pull together those "few genuine members" as she could to form a devoted group within the TS who genuinly believed in the phiolosophy she presented and were willing to endevour to lead the life required to become an Adept themselves one day. This required strict disapline and the comittement to live a certain type of life. She called this group the Esoteric School of Theosophy. Howerver after the death of HPB the TS slowly began to change into what was beginning to look like another religion. This is what I believe the 1900 letter was refering to. By the early 1920's the TS had lost it ways completely. It was, IMO, Krishnamurti that saved the TS from the obvious path of distruction by choosing not to become its GURU and figurehead. His leaving the TS had and immediate impact and over the next 30 years there was enough regeneration within the TS to perhaps give it a chance to continue its work of planting those seeds. > I very much like that the letter mentions that the Masters do not bend the will of another to their own -- as there has been so much of deception and the authoritative control drama that has been foisted on young ones. The spiritual path is walked in freedom. Is there such a thing? Certainly it is our choice whether we take up the opertunities offered us or we choose to become lost within yet another physical incarnation and perhaps have to wait again another 1000 years before such an opurtunity arises again. Does it really matter if the TS is doing its job or not? It is more important that we as individuals do what we believe is right. Cheers John -- John Vorstermans | Obstacles are what you see john@actrix.gen.nz | when you take your eyes off Help desk - (04) 499-1122 | the goal From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 20:24:07 -0400 From: APRIORIPAA@aol.com Subject: Re: 1900 K.H. Letter? Hi John, >KH and M who were two of the main instigators of planting the idea of the "Theosophical Seed" back in 1875 were not so much interested in how the "seeds" were planted but that they actually were planted. Indeed so, my understanding also is that it was the Tibetan Master D.K. who provided her with most of the "Secret Doctrine." >it was stated in several articles that there they would no longer be able to communicated in writing (as they were) when HPB was no longer in physical incarnation Does this mean that there would never again be any initiates in incaration who would be willing and able to communicate (via the fully conscious higher psychism) the Master's wisdom? Or that the Masters could not send a letter by normal post? I do not know how the K.H. 1900 letter was written or delivered. >Certainly it is our choice whether we take up the opertunities offered us or we choose to become lost within yet another physical incarnation and perhaps have to wait again another 1000 years before such an opurtunity arises again. I believe also that the opportunity of right choice leads to greater love and freedom. [Part of the previous point being that there are those who deceive the innocent into thinking that there is opportunity in obeying another -- there never is and this results only in slavery (with its appropriate lessons).]. >Does it really matter if the TS is doing its job or not? It is more simportant that we as individuals do what we believe is right. Amen -- and hopefully spiritual groups will evolve. Peace, Patrick From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 20:27:05 -0400 From: APRIORIPAA@aol.com Subject: Re: 1900 K.H. Letter? Hi John, > KH and M who were two of the main instigators of planting the idea of the "Theosophical Seed" back in 1875 were not so much interested in how the "seeds" were planted but that they actually were planted. Indeed so, my understanding also is that it was the Tibetan Master D.K. who provided her with most of the "Secret Doctrine." > it was stated in several articles that there they would no longer be able to communicated in writing (as they were) when HPB was no longer in physical incarnation Does this mean that there would never again be any initiates in incaration who would be willing and able to communicate (via the fully conscious higher psychism) the Master's wisdom? Or that the Masters could not send a letter by normal post? I do not know how the K.H. 1900 letter was written or delivered. > Certainly it is our choice whether we take up the opertunities offered us or we choose to become lost within yet another physical incarnation and perhaps have to wait again another 1000 years before such an opurtunity arises again. I believe also that the opportunity of right choice leads to greater love and freedom. [Part of the previous point being that there are those who deceive the innocent into thinking that there is opportunity in obeying another -- there never is and this results only in slavery (with its appropriate lessons).]. > Does it really matter if the TS is doing its job or not? It is more simportant that we as individuals do what we believe is right. Amen -- and hopefully spiritual groups will evolve. Peace, Patrick From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000 Date: 02 Aug 1995 21:35:37 EDT From: Jerry Schueler <76400.1474@compuserve.com> Subject: Re Paul - Anagrams Paul: